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Comments on: Abortion Protest Misses the Point http://penndems.org/archives/67 Mon, 08 Sep 2008 06:13:52 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5 By: Barry Slaff http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-71 Barry Slaff Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:19:26 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-71 Mike, A woman's choice to have an abortion does not impose on anyone. However, an outside force preventing her having an abortion certainly imposes on her. The two sides are not symmetrical, contrary to what you suggest. Furthermore, comprehensive sex education does not (and should not) present promiscuous sex as a favorable alternative to abstinence. The same experts cited in the article say that abstinence should be encouraged as the best option, and other options should be described as well. The message is "abstinence is the safest choice, but if you must, here's how," rather than "take some rubbers and go have fun." Further, consider the psychological impact of sex being something one learns about in school instead of this unspeakable, unacknowledged act. As the research shows, the net result is certainly not more sex than happens anyway. I appreciate your intelligently-written feedback. -Barry Mike,

A woman’s choice to have an abortion does not impose on anyone. However, an outside force preventing her having an abortion certainly imposes on her. The two sides are not symmetrical, contrary to what you suggest.

Furthermore, comprehensive sex education does not (and should not) present promiscuous sex as a favorable alternative to abstinence. The same experts cited in the article say that abstinence should be encouraged as the best option, and other options should be described as well. The message is “abstinence is the safest choice, but if you must, here’s how,” rather than “take some rubbers and go have fun.” Further, consider the psychological impact of sex being something one learns about in school instead of this unspeakable, unacknowledged act. As the research shows, the net result is certainly not more sex than happens anyway.

I appreciate your intelligently-written feedback.

-Barry

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By: Mike http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-68 Mike Wed, 24 Oct 2007 16:04:19 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-68 The author of the article basically comes to the conclusion that "if abortion is bad, then we should work to stop unwanted pregnancies." So the suggested solution operates on the basis that it has been pre-established that abortion is bad. But the article makes a false assumption in analyzing Stand True. Saying that Stand True is 'pro-life', or 'anti-abortion' alone is not enough. Let us suppose for a moment that this was the only stance made my Stand True. Then the article makes complete sense. As 'anti-abortionists', we should be furthering the availability of contraceptives, of furthering sex education classes to promote 'Safe Sex'. All this would severely reduce the number of abortions, which (as we determined above) is most certainly a good goal. But Stand True is not just 'pro-life', it is 'Christ-centered pro-life'. This changes everything. Now we must analyze Stand True as a group of Christians coming together to stop abortion in a Christlike manner. The assumption still stands - abortion is bad, and needs to be avoided - but the methods must change. Spreading the availability of contraceptives implies that sexual relations between anyone is OK, as long as there are no repercussions (i.e. a pregnancy). Or, in other words, go ahead and do it, you won't be held responsible. This violates the Christian ideology that sexual intercourse should be reserved for two married people. From a Christian standpoint the only valid contraceptive pre-marriage is abstinence, which should be practiced out of reverence for the ideal of marriage, not because we don't want abortions. In this analytical light, the article's solution fails. It clearly does not take into account the faith and belief of the very group it tries to break down (though, to credit the author, it at least tries by assuming a 'pro-life' mantle in providing a solution). As far as 'imposing a belief system on others,' when you try to convince us that a fetus is not a human being, are you not imposing your beliefs on us? The fact is, truth has not been decided in this matter. Either the fetus is a human, or it isn't. I don't know. I believe that the fetus is a human, but I don't know. I would warrant that you believe the fetus is not a human, but you don't know. Neither of us know, because I don't think experts have agreed on a definition of 'living' yet, so we cannot determine if the fetus is 'living'. So until we know for certain, any argument for either side is 'imposing beliefs on others', not just the 'pro-life' side. Always be willing to look at your own stance with a critical eye, rather than viewing yourself as morally superior to those you debate against. The author of the article basically comes to the conclusion that “if abortion is bad, then we should work to stop unwanted pregnancies.” So the suggested solution operates on the basis that it has been pre-established that abortion is bad. But the article makes a false assumption in analyzing Stand True. Saying that Stand True is ‘pro-life’, or ‘anti-abortion’ alone is not enough.

Let us suppose for a moment that this was the only stance made my Stand True. Then the article makes complete sense. As ‘anti-abortionists’, we should be furthering the availability of contraceptives, of furthering sex education classes to promote ‘Safe Sex’. All this would severely reduce the number of abortions, which (as we determined above) is most certainly a good goal.

But Stand True is not just ‘pro-life’, it is ‘Christ-centered pro-life’. This changes everything. Now we must analyze Stand True as a group of Christians coming together to stop abortion in a Christlike manner. The assumption still stands - abortion is bad, and needs to be avoided - but the methods must change. Spreading the availability of contraceptives implies that sexual relations between anyone is OK, as long as there are no repercussions (i.e. a pregnancy). Or, in other words, go ahead and do it, you won’t be held responsible. This violates the Christian ideology that sexual intercourse should be reserved for two married people. From a Christian standpoint the only valid contraceptive pre-marriage is abstinence, which should be practiced out of reverence for the ideal of marriage, not because we don’t want abortions.

In this analytical light, the article’s solution fails. It clearly does not take into account the faith and belief of the very group it tries to break down (though, to credit the author, it at least tries by assuming a ‘pro-life’ mantle in providing a solution).

As far as ‘imposing a belief system on others,’ when you try to convince us that a fetus is not a human being, are you not imposing your beliefs on us? The fact is, truth has not been decided in this matter. Either the fetus is a human, or it isn’t. I don’t know. I believe that the fetus is a human, but I don’t know. I would warrant that you believe the fetus is not a human, but you don’t know. Neither of us know, because I don’t think experts have agreed on a definition of ‘living’ yet, so we cannot determine if the fetus is ‘living’. So until we know for certain, any argument for either side is ‘imposing beliefs on others’, not just the ‘pro-life’ side. Always be willing to look at your own stance with a critical eye, rather than viewing yourself as morally superior to those you debate against.

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By: Shannon http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-64 Shannon Wed, 24 Oct 2007 02:25:06 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-64 GREAT article. I'm not even from Pennsylvania, but having worked in a community health center and met many unintentionally expecting families, I love your work. GREAT article. I’m not even from Pennsylvania, but having worked in a community health center and met many unintentionally expecting families, I love your work.

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By: Jillian http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-42 Jillian Fri, 19 Oct 2007 05:32:35 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-42 Excellent article and so well written. Bravo! Excellent article and so well written. Bravo!

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By: Cassie http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-39 Cassie Thu, 18 Oct 2007 20:49:18 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-39 same old Barry. excellent job conveying the point and not getting caught up in logistics. same old Barry. excellent job conveying the point and not getting caught up in logistics.

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By: Felicia http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-37 Felicia Thu, 18 Oct 2007 19:15:51 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-37 great points, great argument, great purpose :) great points, great argument, great purpose :)

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By: Sarah http://penndems.org/archives/67#comment-36 Sarah Thu, 18 Oct 2007 19:03:45 +0000 http://blog.penndems.org/archives/67#comment-36 I LOVE IT!!! Very well written. You may want to add, however, that pro-choice movements are NOT anti-life movements. I LOVE IT!!! Very well written. You may want to add, however, that pro-choice movements are NOT anti-life movements.

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